VictorPride banned by WhyIsCaeciliusTaken

Ban Appeals Game Ban Appeals
1

CKEY: VictorPride

Admin’s CKEY: WhyIsCaeciliusTaken

Is this for both servers or just one? If so, which one: Global

Which server did the ban happen on? Sage

Ban Type: Server

Ban Length: Permanently

Ban Date (MM/DD/YYYY): 2020/05/05

Round ID: 15534

Ban Reason:
See player report

Appeal Reason:
The new Discord changes mean I can’t verify and read it anymore so that prompted me to appeal now rather than later.

Firstly let me say if unbanned I won’t repeat that behaviour again. I’ve been a very long-term player, admin, council member, coder, mentor and I should have known better. This was my first and only questionable incident after almost 2000 hours however so I was surprised that I got slapped with a perma where there are many people who’ve done far more rule breaks and get unbanned with regularity, including for erotic content.

Regarding the rule break itself: let’s not pretend the harmless PG-12 (at maximum) flirting between two adults that occurred is equivalent to the kind of hardcore ERP that would make perfect sense to shield children from.

If the rules still can’t discern the very obvious differences between the two then it’s clear they need a, what is it, fourth rework now? Then again the last rework allowed hardcore porn copypastas again so I can’t tell if kids are being shielded more appropriately or less over time.

And I say PG-12 specifically because I looked up PEGI ratings and PG-12 allows “sexual innuendo or sexual posturing” which includes more risque activities like sexually suggestive dance routines, scenes of implied sexual activity and even brief glimpses of nudity. So basically what happened was more tame than content even 12 year olds can watch, since it additionally certainly isn’t referring to pixelated characters.

That is aside from the fact that children are already being exposed to adult content since SS13 is undeniably an adult game. Bee’s upstream codebase /tg/ is 18+ because they realised that being able to disembowl and behead someone, put them on a meat spike then deep fry and vore their body parts is content that is clearly not meant for kids.

Why Bee doesn’t have the “don’t ask, don’t tell” 18+ rule of every other /tg/ downstream server I’ll never know, it’s false advertising but I guess when Golden is still marketed as a “beginners server” that’s just par for the course.

When my ban is put in contrast to incidents like that guy who did actual ERP with a moth and didn’t get perma’d, or the catgirl everyone knows that has got like 5 notes for ERP and not perma’d, or the people who spam extremely sexually graphic copypastas yet can appeal their bans, I find it a rather baffling instance of cognitive dissonance that this incident is made out to be more harmful to kids than all of them and the rest of SS13’s adult content combined.

It’s especially clear when for months afterwards the ban was hotly debated by most of the community and rules hastily amended multiple times. I’m unsure if this was just the final excuse to ban Winter and I got caught up in it, which is why I’d like this appeal to be reviewed with fresh eyes on my individual clean past record.

Rant on the rules inconsistency aside, I will abide by them if unbanned as I have done for the 99.99% of my playtime on Bee. I’ve had a ton of good times on Bee and made lots of friends there so I’d like the opportunity to continue them. Thanks for your time and reading this appeal.

6 Likes
6

Locking this and waiting for admin comment

1 Like
8

No, it allowed one chance to be given for them because our stance compared to other servers was quite extreme and getting irrevocably perma-banned because you didn’t read the rules carefully didn’t sit well with anyone. The ban is still supposed to be permanent on the second offense, because there is no “I didn’t know!” excuse anymore.

I was responsible for the moth situation and was told I acted incorrectly, and this was brought up for every other past instance of ERP that was appealed as well without specific names thrown out there. It is then declared that this is how all ERP situations should have been handled, invalidating past precedent and setting a new(ish) one.

I don’t believe in first offense perma for anything short of blatant and intentional misconduct, but this was overruled by both the community and admins senior to me at the time. Many other players since have been banned as a result of this precedent, and Velvet’s appeal was somewhat recently denied as well.

I don’t see this being lifted as a matter of principle, despite being a first offense and being the ban that re-formed the precedent from what it was (in practice at least) prior to this ban.

2 Likes
10

Rules change over time. I don’t think it to be unreasonable to at-least suggest next staff meeting for possible one time pardons for previous people guilty of this who simply did it once. You and I seem to both share the idea that perm bans on first offenses are almost intolerable unless the action is truly egregious.

While Victor has had a long and rich history in Bee, I do not ask for you to do it for him specifically but for all future cases. Do we not become guilty ourselves if we lack compassion and forgiveness? If we are to be excellent to each other we shouldn’t hold eternal grudges against people.

11

Tbh I think this appeal could’ve been a lot more. better. considering. Regardless, I never really understood the aggressive stance to NOT unban Victor and Velvet. I think leaving them banned only serves the purpose of upholding a no-exceptions ERP policy. I do not think that this ban of Victor and Velvet has actually shielded children from inappropriate content. So ? Like lmao they’re not bad people

13

as someone who had to witness the last shitshow that the appeal of VictorPride and Velvet turned into I still think that the perma ban was too harsh a punishment for what the content actually was, not to mention from my memory they were in a pod by themselves and did not talk to each in a inappropriate manner on any comms channels meaning the argument of shielding children doesn’t really function here since I don’t even know if anyone would have noticed the ERP if admins didn’t point it out and fire the ban.

2 Likes
15

yeah same here I thought a perma was WAY too harsh for this

it also still doesn’t sit well with me that nobody seemed to have any problem with this until Xylana made a fuss about it in the form of a player report

4 Likes
16

This servers “stance” is now so deep in shit, that noone would mind him being unbanned, hell we stepped under TG. also victor is based

19

I’d probably be willing to accept this.

4 Likes
20

Yeah and since this forum appeal has had 111 views and only 10 replies i dont think anyone actually cares anymore about Victor or Velvet since this ban appeal has been slower then a snail.

22

what do you mean? Ruko literally disagrees with lifting the ban read what he wrote

25

I feel like its best to come to a decision soon about whether or not VictorPride and Velvet are getting unbanned or not since last appeal turned into a 114 long message spam

27

Not really, since ghosts exist and can pretty much view anything they want. In fact, they were being orbited by one of em when the screenshot was taken.

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also if a kid is playing space station 13 they’ve already gone down the darker parts of the internet where the worst word that was uttered in their ERP being healslut is definitely not the worst word that “child” has heard

32

honestly, I’m inclined to agree, but with the recent admin decisions regarded ERP and their rugged determination to protect the poor kids from anything slightly sexual, despite the game taking place on a bloodied slave ship where people cuss like pirates… It certainly lines up for them.

33

well Caecillius is the admin that fired the ban and he seems to be okay with lifting it so unless theres a major debate going on in disc right now this ban appeal shouldn’t be as bad as the last one became.

35

I don’t see any reason why he shouldn’t be unbanned.