Friendly Wizards

[Doctor_Ape]

Good to know. That is something that could be changed in my opinion. Giving it a check if the object that got hit has spell immunity for example and if it does, removes the fireball detonation.

[Crossedfall]

It’s not validhunting if they are openly an antag. If a wizard isn’t going stealth and they openly showcase that they are a wizard, then yes, the crew should absolutely respond in turn.

[michiru2]

I think most people are probably too worried about valid hunting rules to act on an otherwise inactive wizard but that’s just speculation on my part

[Crossedfall]

@Pirill

The counterpoint to that is that in most cases a robust wizard with a murderbone kit will utterly decimate everyone with no significant counterplay which is exactly what happened with wizard number two that round. That ends up being fun only for the wizard themselves unless someone pulls a cheese tactic to kill them. I’m definitely not going to go engage a wizard as the vast majority of roles because I know they’ll just kill me immediately unless I can do it faster.

I don’t actually find this to be a counterpoint for what I was saying. If anything that supports my argument that the crew should be weary of ANY wizard that shows up; since it’s possible that any wizard could be this utterly robust individual. (This on top of the established lore and SoP reasons to act against wizards)

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@michiru2

I think most people are probably too worried about valid hunting rules to act on an otherwise inactive wizard but that’s just speculation on my part

I think that’d be a misunderstanding of the rules then, since again, that wouldn’t be validhunting. You’re not hunting for a valid to kill, you have a clear and obvious enemy of the corporation. It’s the exact same principal with Xenos.

[michiru2]

Yeah but… misunderstandings are always gonna happen, and most people aren’t robust enough to deal with a wizard anyway and will prefer to stay out of the fight.

It’s a numbers game. Sometimes it’ll just shake out in a way that there are no crew members willing to take on the wizard at all and the wizard will take the path of least resistance rather than go murder-crazy.

The real problem here is that wizard is so rare it’s hard to get any good data. It’s all just speculation, really.

[Pirill]

@Crossedfall

the crew should be weary of ANY wizard that shows up; since it’s possible that any wizard could be this utterly robust individual.

In that case this encourages a maximum efficiency mentality where the wizard knows they’ll likely be killed on sight so they’re incentivized to pick only the most murderboney and efficient killing kit they can, while the crew is incentivized to use bombs or similar tactics that can kill the wizard before they can reasonably react. Maybe that’s how you want the game mode to play out but it certainly doesn’t seem like the most fun option considering all the fun tools wizards have at their disposal.

[thebigpgm153]

If wizard’s kit consisted of more less lethal crowd control (mass superlube spell ?) and less instant round removal (disintegrate needs to become admin only, and slaughter demons should leave devoured bodies behind), wizard would be a way less problematic gamemode. Having essentially a clown on MRP powergame steroïds with antagonist status could probably be a great refresher fromthe murderbone fest efficient wizard is now.

[Crossedfall]

@Pirill

In that case this encourages a maximum efficiency mentality where the wizard knows they’ll likely be killed on sight

That does come with playing as one of the rarer & deadliest enemies of the corporation, yes. Again, similar to xenos. As for crew response, that’s pretty heavily dependent on the server, as RP encourages crew to work more with security than directly combating the antag (obviously this is somewhat dynamic based on what’s going on). Buuut that also depends on how the wizard actually tries to approach their objectives…

@Pirill

Maybe that’s how you want the game mode to play out but it certainly doesn’t seem like the most fun option considering all the fun tools wizards have at their disposal.

@Crossedfall

I by no means think that wizards should be entirely relegated to murder. There’s a lot of potential for fun and interesting stealth, manipulation, and gorilla play that can also be had. Especially for the less lethal objectives

It’s almost like you aren’t reading my full responses, as I feel like I have already attempted to comment on both of these.

[Efe]

friendly wizards are pointless unless they’d get some kind of OOC protection which wont happen

[Doctor_Ape]

Nah, wizards have enough ways to defend themselves. If they die to some random simpleton, so be it.

[Efe]

i mean it like
friendly wizards arent possible
because 1. valid 2. can be made valid

[J.I.JOE]

Staff of change > murderboning with fireball

[Doctor_Ape]

Yes, but that does not mean anything. “Friendly” wizards are wizards that don’t actively go out of their way to do objectives or kill crew. If you come to them and you are looking for trouble,… well… just because someone is valid does not mean all of crew or hell, even sec will hunt them. It depends on the individual player and how they play it out. Some will just have conversations with you, some ask you for gifts, some will try to valid you ( and usually end up dead) and some will just ignore you.

[Doctor_Ape]

But why would you turn the guy that wants to bash your head in into an even more deadly foe

[Efe]

1. be friendly wizard, not trying to bone whole station
2. chill with few people show them magic tricks because mrp
3. secman comes in and stunbatons you
4. stunned wizard = dead wizard
5. fight back
6. congrats you are now forced to murderbone wholestation

[J.I.JOE]

Because it would be fun

[Doctor_Ape]

@Efe

secman comes in and stunbatons you

just

• forcewall and laugh at him,
• cast the aoe stun spell and take his baton, cuff him
• blow his brain up
• teleport away
• time stop
  …
  if you are that unrobust to get nonlethally apprehended as wiznerd… yeah you deserve it.

Just act like you have lavaland escalation as wiznerd and it’s the most fun. No one says you have to be Ghandhi and play completely pacifistic.

@Efe

you dont really understand what i mean

i really don’t.

[Efe]

you dont really understand what i mean

[irie]

I think it’s an IC conflict. Wizard/Crew cooperation should have the Wizard League and Nanotrasen both believing their people to be rogue. Wizard League sends in someone/people to deal with the traitor wizard, and Nanotrasen, maybe believing their staff to be bewitched, sends some sort of ERT in to blow the station, or something of the like.

Kind of what happened the other day, except I think this gives more room for RP instead of “Friendly Wizard? Send in mass murderboning Wizard!”

[ivanmixo]

@J.I.JOE

Staff of change > murderboning with fireball

I would rather die than be turned into a slime by a transform staff wiz again