Title: kitkatzz banned by winterdarkraven due to desperate messures
CKEY: kitkatzz
Admin’s CKEY: winterdarkraven
Is this for both servers or just one? If so, which one: Sage
Ban Type: server!?
Ban Length: 7 days
Ban Date (MM/DD/YYYY): 01 14 2021 - 23:31
Round ID: 26076
Ban Reason: As a subverted AI flooded the station with plasma, setting the plasma on fire. Their reason was to kill some targets for their master. Their master did not ask for the station to be flooded. Try Golden LRP if you want to flood the staiton.
Appeal Reason:
we where assisting zane in killing his targets and preforming sacrafices.
zane declared himself only crew (probbably to stop my borgs complaining about all the dead wittnesses of his traitoring).
dururing the rather long endevour of target murder my borgs got called out as rouge 3 seperate times
at this point i was fairly certain sec knew i was malf or where soon to put 2 and 2 together.
on top of all that they have found out the identity of zane and where hunting him down.
a situaton even worse considering he was the probably the LAST heretic remaining.
then comes the order via my borg as direct communication was impossible
det and some other sec are to be killed. i lock onto them and find them in brig surrounded by ALL of sec and some mechs. the shift is at this point is getting rather long so i fear that the shuttle could get called. and considering all previous issuess as well. (im probably soon to be exposed, my master is exposed, there are 5 of us vs all of sec and a few mechs who already delt with all other heretics, the shift might end soon,). i do the only thing that i see can get us out of this shitshow. I holoflood brig try to kill as much sec as possible and my 2 targets.
the holoflood doesnt go as far as i expected and i need to substitute with standard plasmaflood so i setup atmos and continue flooding sec. after some time of trying to get det HOS locksdown my borgs from RD’s office and leaves. i unlock them and flood RD’s office to destroy the console knowing just bolting and cutting power wont do shit. some plasma gets to the rest of science but to be fair it was empty.
and then zane gives me one more murder objective kill bob in west main hallway. 2 borgs are busy keeping zane safe 1 borg is dead i take it into my own hands and flood west hallway as the shuttle is comming and there is no time for hesetations.
i then retreat my attention to my SAT to defend myself from a few angry crew and i pretty much do that and keep an eye on zane till the rest of the shift.
in conclusion
i destroyed sec due to the fact that they where a MAJOR threat to us and because there where 2 targets among them.
i flooded science to stop my borgs from getting blown. and considerin zane was riding one that would have been BAD.
-i flooded west hallway becaue zane told me to kill a dude there and i had no time for surgical precision.
the crewsimov laws where at this point just for show as zane declared himself only crew
Additional Information:
i flooded 3 areas any other floodings where incidental. who knows maybe my borgs took advantage of atmos
be fair if an AI gets exposed and doesnt unleash hell to at least science engineering and sec
it’s gonna get assblassted in 5-15 minutes.
The heat and plasma spread was far greater than you intended. The main hallway, command hallway, service areas, the science maintenance to engineering maintenance, dorms, security hallway (fore hallway) and below, and aft hallway was uninhabitable.
This is really big collateral damage for wanting to kill only three people, a lot of which weren’t witnesses or had any intent on harming Zane or yourself.
Plasmaflooding the station without direct orders to has a good chance (or at least confirming it with your subverter) has a good chance to harm your subverter.
i had the law to protect zane from danger therefore sec who knew that he was a heretic and where gunning for him considering he was the last heretic left.
i had the law to pretect myself and therefore zane from sec who at this point surely knew i was malf
and i had a command to kill 2 sec officers located in hevily populated brig.
3 birds 1 stone.
I have to add that I was a ghosting this round(After a failed BSA attack on the AI),
And I did notice that AI only targeted specific people and didn’t shock or bolt doors
per crewsimov or asimov, your goal isn’t to achieve the path of least harm. your goal is to do nothing that would cause harm to the crew through action or inaction. if crew get harmed either way, then you start picking ways to get them to safety (such as dragging a person in crit through a breached area if you think you can get them treated before they bleed out).
by laws, i think this is okay. AI had borgs around Zane to track him and make sure he could sac targets just by them bringing corpses to him, so Zane did not have to be subjected to any burning areas. plasma is one of the only good options the AI has to defend Zane, itself, and its borgs, so it can afford to circumvent law 2 due to law 1 priorities to eliminate his enemies.
problem comes when you consider server rules, not AI laws. this is like purge-lawed AI’s killing people who haven’t done anything to them, it’s not proper escalation at all. if you’d restricted your plasmaburn to security (which is already hard to do b/c of how distro works), it would’ve been fine. flooding west hallway, also fine since it was by zane’s request. flooding science just in case people tried to access the RD office, though, plus flooding other unrelated areas is not fine.
most vents around the station are set, by default, to ~101kPa, external mode. that means that when they detect the air around them is below 101kPa, they push out whatever is in their pipe into the air until it reaches 101kPa, then they shut off. even if you only intentionally fiddled with the air alarms around those areas, plasma would still be going to areas with below 101kPa, such as places that got a bit cold or breached or what-have-you. this is why plasmaflooding is a terribly unselective method, especially on a long round where there would be plenty of atmos fluctuations: you just can’t control it from doing collateral damage, and unless you seriously restrict the amount of plasma flowing into the distro loop, there will be enough to seriously damage random zones.
it’s just bad business to be doing as an AI without explicit “murder everyone” orders. i recommend using CO2 first, because all scrubbers around the station are naturally set to scrub CO2, most people don’t notice it, it has higher heat capacity, and it’s infinitely more subtle. your collateral damage will shoot way down, and if it’s not enough, you can try a selective plasma burn with the knowledge that the CO2 will help choke fires in areas you’re not targeting.
initaly i wasnt even going to atmos flood i was going to holoflood. using the holodeck a selective sec only flood. but the plasma didnt go as far as usual and i had to plasmaflood in a panic because 90% of angry sec remained 100% sure i was malf and HOS was giving the ION cannon some funny looks. and then everything else happened in a blur.
