Brother_Hangyul banned for being security

Ban Appeals Game Ban Appeals
1

CKEY: Brother_Hangyul

Admin’s CKEY: Aeder

Is this for both servers or just one? If so, which one: Both.

Ban Type: Job-ban.

Ban Length: 3 Days.

Ban Date: 09/13/2020

Round ID: 21236

Ban Reason: Executed a player for a confirmed capital crime, however had no auth from captain.

Appeal Reason: Firstly, I’d like to know why no action was taken if somebody just flat-out took the hypospray because that’s obvious self-antagging. Secondly, literally doing my job. Man committed a capital crime, I asked over command comms what to do about 5 times and settled on euthanization when SWINSTON came in quite literally 5 seconds too late.

I understand that I’ve done a bit of wrong here, but it genuinely doesn’t warrant a ban; the HOS is not allowed to authorize executions, apparently, but I’ve seen dozens of them execute both antag and non-antag without authorization; hell I’ve seen wardens do it. Each time? Nobody cares. Not sure why I’m being singularly outed for it. Killing a self-antagger warrants a note at most.

Additional Information: hecc

2

You need to put this also under “Game Ban Appeals” also what happend to Which server did the ban happen on? also this wasnt a ban for both servers, it was a sage only ban

3

why didint you atleast listen to my side of the story before rushing out to kill me? CMO was being a dick,pushing people around and spraying ALL OVER the med. that was shitsec behaviour. i say ban is deserved.

4

16:12:31

PM from aeder1 to Brother_Hangyul/(Hangyul Kim)

You executed for the hypospray yes?

16:12:31

Claimed by Aeder1/(Aeder)

16:12:31

Reply PM from Aeder1/(Aeder)

You executed for the hypospray yes?

16:12:46

Reply PM from Brother_Hangyul/(Hangyul Kim)

Aye, stole it from the CMO (Capital Crime)

16:12:56

Reply PM from Aeder1/(Aeder)

Who is acting cap?

16:13:08

Reply PM from Brother_Hangyul/(Hangyul Kim)

No acting captain, it’s just SWINSTON(?|F) as normal cap

16:13:55

Reply PM from Aeder1/(Aeder)

Cap gave auth to perma them, not execute

16:14:08

Reply PM from Brother_Hangyul/(Hangyul Kim)

He did it about 10-20 seconds too late

16:14:43

Reply PM from Aeder1/(Aeder)

Even worse, you need cap auth to execute/force cyborg for capital. You have auth to perma them as HoS.

16:15:49

Reply PM from Brother_Hangyul/(Hangyul Kim)

hol’ up that’s new shit I, along with many HOS’s have exeucted traitors / serious shitters of our own decision and the captain hasn’t complained. Is this new or is this just forgotten to time?

16:16:10

Reply PM from Aeder1/(Aeder)

Think option 2, it’s on the wiki under space(?|F) law tho, jusut above hte text box of capital. “Only the Captain, HoS, and Warden can authorize a Permanent Sentence. Only the Captain can authorize an Execution or Forced Cyborgization.”

16:16:42

Reply PM from Brother_Hangyul/(Hangyul Kim)

tfw you’ve played sec for 100+ hours and never seen this rule come into play

16:17:17

Reply PM from Aeder1/(Aeder)

No worries, just means you’ll neeed to read up on space(?|F) law. You understand tho has to be a job bean for it tho.

16:18:40

Reply PM from Brother_Hangyul/(Hangyul Kim)

I don’t really see a point since what I did was completely valid; captain came in a tad too late and, IIRC, traitors / people acting like traitors can be executed on the spot (Correct me if incorrect)

16:19:29

Reply PM from Aeder1/(Aeder)

Well the Cap never even gave execution auth, only perma. Execution on the spot is only valid if they say are carrying a esword or murderboning or such. At that time you had them cuffed and secured in brig.

16:20:23

Reply PM from Brother_Hangyul/(Hangyul Kim)

They had committed a capital crime, though. If the Captain says it was okay afterwards would that be enough to prove my actions were valid?

16:20:40

Reply PM from Brother_Hangyul/(Hangyul Kim)

I genuinely don’t see this warranting more than a note.

16:21:48

Reply PM from Aeder1/(Aeder)

Nope, you need the authorisation to do something before you do it. A side note is that the player also had valid reasons for doing so which could’ve been investigated.

16:22:12

Reply PM from Brother_Hangyul/(Hangyul Kim)

Vandilization isn’t worthy of hypo-spray stealing, nor do I see how it’s related.

16:23:07

Reply PM from Aeder1/(Aeder)

They had reasons, which means they were likely not a traitor. Either way the main issue is you executed without cap auth. When cap auth came through it was only for perma.

6

The ban is 100% warranted if this happened on sage, you are required to follow space law. If you didn’t get permission from cap you can just perma them for the meantime. If you’ve seen multiple people do it without authorization why haven’t you ahelped it? Also just because other people have gotten away with it doesn’t mean you will.

7

to be honest captain is always a braindead useless bum who is most likely too drunk to respond.

~Only good captain i ever seen was me~

just kidding im a dirty validhunter

2 Likes
8

I was under the impression it was okay.

9

image
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Well he’s harrasing me in DM’s :slight_smile:

10

Ah yes, spraypaint somehow validates stealing his hypospray.

A hypospray doesn’t even do anything other than medical shit, you took it and filled it with morphine. Cringe.

11

To be honest Space Law needs to be updated but can’t because the wiki page is currently protected. HoS should be able to authorise executions, it’s literally his job to choose the solution that will keep the station safe and prevent his staff from being overwhelmed. Captains don’t have to authorise any other common activity of any other department, not even building combat mechs or additional risky engines which have the capacity for mass casualties.

Similarly “Only the Captain, HoS, and Warden can authorize a Permanent Sentence.” needs to be updated. What is a Security Officer supposed to do with a criminal that has committed a Capital crime but their superiors are all busy when he asks for the 5th time what to do with them? It should be required to inform their superior who’s getting perma’d and why, but not authorisation to do so in the first place.

5 Likes
12

This might sound sarcastic but it’s genuinely not; thank you for your input, that shit makes sense.

13

I agree a little bit, but part of needing to get permission from superiors is to make sure people don’t abuse power. HOS attracts powerhungry players and having someone that they need permission to execute someone is meant to keep HOS in check. For officers to be able to authorize perm sentences I have mixed feelings about, mainly because of the amount of officers I’ve seen try to convince the ward/HOS that the guy that called them a cunt over comms deserves to be perma’d and other over dramatizing. Ward is required (unless it’s a emergency) to stay at the brig at all timesso they should be able to approve a perma in most situations. If they’re dicking around and not actually busy just bug them more or if needed ahelp.

Though tbh after looking at other servers version of space law we do need to update and change them.

1 Like
14

While I agree with you, perma exists for a reason. If the prisoner is too dangerous you can execute him on the spot.

15

The thing is, I’d be happy to wait for a go-ahead w/ a competent captain, but most of the time they’re either bigger edgelords than the warden on a powertrip or just keep going AFK without notifying us. SWINSTON literally left me hanging for a solid 10 minutes, at which point I had to take shit into my own hands. I decided to execute him since he was acting like a traitor, did traitor shit and admittedly because him salting in LOOC and threatening to call the admins on me pissed me of a wee lil’ bit (Mainly the self-antagging though). I’d still like to know why he actually stole the hypospray; the CMO using a spraycan on the walls isn’t grounds to take his HYPOSPRAY; not his spray-can, his deliverer-of-healthy-drugs.

16

This argument also holds for why Officers and Warden can’t execute, but HoS should be able to.

HOS doesn’t attract that type of player any more than Captains do, if anything I’d wish they were more decisive about things generally.

Seems that would warrant a security role ban if they were flaunting Space Law that egregiously.

Often it’s the case they’re busy dealing with one or several things at once that have higher urgency, of course otherwise I’d just keep waiting and asking.

Agreed, like most of the wiki it’s quite outdated.

There’s multiple reasons why people should be executed such as them being a Rev Head, perma being too full, they’ve proved themselves too robust and deadly, etc. None of these currently qualify under “Use of Deadly Force” but any experienced Security is going to recognise that these situations are acceptable, and the HoS should be able to make this decision rather than waiting on the Captain.

17

‘super valid’ type things are already there tbh

like if im a sec officer and find gang leader shit in someones backpack im curbstomping them about 0.2 seconds after finding it

18

yeah but there are no proper superiors, well there is a “cap” But lets be serious, people who play cap
usually are incapable of anything.
You will have to drag that donkey to the criminal and explain him 20 times why he is bad, instead of doing your job.

19

Aren’t prisoners supposed to be taken to Brig on the shuttle, even those in perma?

20

Yes, in regards to what part of my reply is this?