CKEY: VictorPride
Your Discord: VictorPride
Offender’s CKEY: Yorpan
LRP or MRP server: MRP
Offender’s In-Game Name (if relevant):
Date (MM-DD-YYYY): 09-12-2020
Round Number: 21182
Rules Broken (if relevant): Antagonist token ruling "antagonist tokens cannot be used on round ending antagonists, also known as conversion antagonists, xenomorphs, wizards, nuclear operatives, blob, etcetera. For a more loose definition, this is any antagonist that poses such a threat it forces an immediate shuttle call, or would literally end the round such as a blob."
Part of Admin/Mentor Conduct Broken (if relevant):
Incident Description:
Greenshift on MRP, Yorpan allowed Guilleco to use an antag token on space dragon. It depressurised much of the station and killed a significant amount of the crew, forcing a shuttle call within 30 mins.
When I was admin, and in the times I’ve used antag tokens as a player I’ve asked to become a number of different antags. Never once have I heard or seen space dragon be allowed. It’s usually forces a shuttle call or ends the round when it arrives as a midround antag an hour into the round, it’s even more of one when it arrives roundstart.
It’s kinda unfair to just flaunt the rules for one person imo, I have asked to use my antag token on a wizard or space ninja before but I got denied because “its against the rules”.
Yeah, even a rev could potentially destroy the station if they know what they are doing. Some antags are easier than others, but they can all deal a crazy amount of damage to the station.
I was the one who answered Yorii question.
In my opinion space dragon didn’t qualify to “conversion/round ending antags” as in space dragon is a midround antag and usually have assasination and stay allive until the end objective. I did not consider the amount of damage space dragon can cause, and i never heard they should be excluded from the antag token pool. Unfortunately no other admin left their opinion under the question so my opinion was taken as granted.
However its to further discuss between admins if they dragons should be allowed or not.
The real problem is that the token was used on a greenshift about which i had no idea.
It’s kinda unfair to just flaunt the rules for one person imo, I have asked to use my antag token on a wizard or space ninja before but I got denied because “its against the rules”.
Space ninja is allowed, you need to ask round start to exchange for it.
having both been a space dragon and killed one before;
they arent that hard to deal with if you have a jetpack and the caps laser, although they can completely fuck over the station even more so now with fastmos
before space dragon wasnt really that big of a deal because breaches didnt mean much
If you can request traitor with martyr and then bomb whole station I see no reason why you can’t request the dragon.
The main focus should be why did he spawn antag on greenshift.
This is the full (current) antagonists token policy.
Antagonist tokens cannot be spent on custom made admin antagonists, only on base game antagonists available through in game means that are not round ending. In the event a server wide admin event is occuring, they can use an antag token to become the antag for that event. In addition, antagonist tokens cannot be used on round ending antagonists, also known as conversion antagonists, xenomorphs, wizards, nuclear operatives, blob, etcetera. For a more loose definition, this is any antagonist that poses such a threat it forces an immediate shuttle call, or would literally end the round such as a blob. Antag tokens are also only to be given for admin fuckups, not crashes or in game bugs. They also cannot be used during conversion rounds or when there are other round-ending antagonists present, and may be refunded.
Becoming an abductor team costs only 1 token for both players.
Space Dragons and Space Ninjas are both extremely powerful - so powerful in fact that I’ve campaigned pretty strongly against them being allowed for antagonist tokens, but they are in fact currently allowed. They are not inherently round ending, because they have no mechanic that immediately ends the round when they succeed at their goal like a nuclear operative or blob does.
Regarding green shift antag tokens - it’s not stated in the policy anywhere at this time that this isn’t allowed. I know I erroneously made the claim that it was in the past. As with all council rulings, antag token policy is being re-written to be clearer and easier to follow.
@anon26938153 I’m sorry you got told you couldn’t be ninja - the admin you spoke to was wrong.
New token policy current draft reads like this:
Hard list of antags token is redeemable for, instead of vague description of what it isn’t redeemable for
Request to use antagonist tokens must come before a round starts, not after.
Round type will be forcibly changed pre-round to traitor or changeling so that the round is neither conversion nor greenshift
For what it’s worth, I think space dragons, wizards and ninjas are all of about equal power and should have had the same treatment of being way too powerful for token redemption since they turn entire rounds on their head in good hands
Among those, space dragon is actually the worst because breaking all the walls and spacing the entire station is the optimal play.
Even if dragon is defeated the station will be beyond any hope of recovery.
Which is also sometimes true of wizards but wizards have so many different builds to play with that station demolisher is not very common.
Every space dragon is station demolisher.
I am glad for your quick reply, and even more so glad if the current fuzzy policy gets updated to a more clearly-defined one.
And I literally had no idea about any policy regarding no use of antag tokens during extended until after this report was submitted because it is in fact not written down anywhere.