Winter Darkraven's ban appeal

Ban Appeals Game Appeals
1

CKEY: Winter Darkraven

Admin’s CKEY: WhyIsCaeciliusTaken

Is this for both servers or just one? If so, which one: Sage.

Ban Type/Ban Length: Temporary, 24 hours.

Ban Date (MM/DD/YYYY): 01/05/2020

Round ID: 15367

Ban Reason: “Wore the HoS hardsuit the entire round because of a single breach in atmos. Wore the suit both long before the existance of said breach and long after they were ever in atmos.”

Appeal Reason: As a gangster roboticist, I made a Ripley MK-II mech to raid security where I took HoS gun, HoS hardsuit, security belt, blah blah blah, I got gamer gear. Went about killing security until I was caught and deconverted, being drafted as the new HoS due to my display of rip and tear. Just as I became the new HoS, I was called off to atmospherics to destroy the gang dominator, where there was a hull breach. Once the dominator was destroyed, we happened to catch a gang leader, I was taking their corpse to the crematorium when I was bwoinked:

"As a non-security & non-command crewmember, you’re not an experienced soldier. Do not rush into danger without reason.

Do not collect dangerous items, weapons, or tools “just in case”. Do not wear a hardsuit, riot suit, or similar bulky/uncomfortable armor for the entire round.

Use reasonable self-defense; subdue, but do not try to revenge-kill, any assailants.

Do not run around with all of the genetic powers, three buffing viruses and the entire armory in your backpack. This is an example of severe powergaming.

Antags are exempt from this rule."

I gave my quick response due to there being confirmed gangsters near me, I had to deconvert one mid-bwoink, which left out key details.

Additional Information: I’m sorry for powergaming as a gangster and not putting away the hardsuit when I went to cremate a gang leader. I’ll role-play better next time, I promise.

2

I was the captain for this shift, there were reports of “HoS” being a fake or being evil in the commons chat before this.

I eventually met Velvet in the halls, I put her in soft crit, mindshielded and healed. They asked me if they can keep the gear, and since they did such a good job causing chaos, they got drafted to cause order.

Fundamentally while I understand the reasoning behind the ban, it’s obtusely arbitrary to apply it as such given they were a former antag, they were not “just” a civilian that got gifted the items.

Conversion antags seem like a grey line and if a higher authority approves of them having said items, it shouldn’t count as powergaming.

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3

Do not wear a hardsuit, riot suit, or similar bulky/uncomfortable armor for the entire round.

Since they were antag for much of the time they were in a hardsuit and not in one for the entire round anyway this doesn’t look like a rule break at all.

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5

metafriend alert.

hey i just wanted to say that powergaming is not cool, we have the LRP server for a reason. this is pretty clear cut powergame since they rushed the one hardsuit that is both spaceproof, bulletproof and fireproof. as this individual constantly powergames and has several notes for it i think the ban should stick as it’s not too terribly long.

6

They rushed the hardsuit - as a gang member.

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7

gang members aren’t antagonists. they’re criminals.

8

https://media.giphy.com/media/xT0xeJpnrWC4XWblEk/giphy.gif(image larger than 4096KB)

9

Gangs are both, they are antagonists and criminals

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10

Length isn’t the issue, it’s the note I want gone.

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11

are you trolling?
20gang

12

big oof ban and note… must be a joke.

13

I waited for over 20 minutes to see if you’d remove it after deconversion. As far as I saw you literally never removed it once you had it.

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14

To be fair the ban is relatively short and the note is just… that. A note i guess. If anything, ask it to be removed in a while after you show not doing it again

Though on the other end, I still think it’s a stupid rule, even for RP standards. Wearing a hardsuit makes you slow as shit 99% of the time, and some jobs should always have’em at hand in case they gotta work fast (Engineers for fixing breachings) or face some threat that’s in the station (Reports about plasmaflooding; keep atmos suit on. Reports about gangs/revs/EAA going wild? Security with hardsuit/Riot suit). In this case, she stole it, she just got dunked on and was allowed to keep the hardsuit to deal with the confirmed threat: gangsters.

Also

This is pretty good thinking and something that I think most people would do in the face of conversion antags. If I catch and deconvert a robust rev or a gangster, and turns out they had a handgun, stun baton, or even something as bulky armor, I think most people here would trust them with it. I’ve seen Captains and HOSs strip deconverted gangsters from all their weapons and act as a walking armory, only for them to get bola’d, stunned and dragged into maint.

Hell tbf i’m surprised Velvet wore it all day knowing how slow it makes you and how Gangsters have access to fucking handguns and SMGs. You’d have been gunned down due to being slow as fuck, even if you could “tank” some shots. Mobility is usually better than bulky armor in this game.

tl;dr rule kinda dumb, hardsuits shouldn’t be considered powergamey unless you are part of a job which shouldn’t even have access to one (Most, if not all civilian jobs, Lawyer, Cargo Techs, Scientists and roboticists, Viro, Chemist, Medical Doctors), and even then they’re usually awful to have on all the time. More of a disadvantage unless you know of a madman going around with a syringe gun. Consider removing note if no powergaming happens later on?

Those are my 2 cents.

15

Mobility on Sage is pretty gimped even without bulky armor, unless you’re chugging speed enhancing drugs

16

Yeah, I’d say show that you aren’t going to break the rule again (for a while) before the note disappears. Admins use prior notes (in part) to determine the severity of future punishments.

17

You saw me at the crematorium, you saw me deconvert gangsters, you saw me walking back to Brig when I actually took off the suit to move faster. I’m sorry if I didn’t take off the suit mid-combat, I had a shotgun in the suit storage and had no where to put it until I saw an officer and gave it to him so I could drag the suit behind me, without leaving anything behind.

This is more of what @Ruediger4 mentioned, the suit is slow. It’s not like I was an unstoppable super soldier ready to kill everyone in sight, movement is key. I wore the suit due to gang life, I was a skirmisher, attacking Brig from space with a mech while in the hardsuit, popping out to take shots then run away. The suit has a jetpack, it’s far from being slow in space, one of the best hit-and-runs out there.

Kinda of funny now that I think of it, HoS room has a breach in it, too. The one that I made.

This leads onto @BrawlerHorde, I powergamed and got deconverted – at what point am I liable for my past actions? Do I have to take off bulky armour mid-combat to avoid another ban or just never wear it? I don’t know, I change sides too fast. Once I’m a gangster, no resistance, I know what to do and why. When I get deconverted, no grudge, no nothing, I’m joining sec to help out.

Maybe that’s my problem, I don’t know.

18

this ban is actually retarded
antag does antag things
deconverted
antag helps the good guys and uses the tools available to them to accomplish this
if they’re actively fighting people with guns in potentially hazardous environments like atmospherics and toxins, there’s no reason for them to not use their best protection

this just seems like something that is “barely” against the rules and was done out of spite

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19

Not antag, normal crew member, a roboticist, who got promoted to HoS I believe? I just saw players complaining about Velvet constantly in dchat about the suit, Velvet wore it for a LONG time, which was simply not needed. So either we remove the rule, or ban more people for doing that.

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20

Denied due to a permanent ban already being in place for something else.