[Unknown] Jack Hack and Ryan Rhineheart Player Report

CKEY: Fronsis

Your Discord: -

Offender’s CKEY: Unknown

Offender’s In-Game Name: Jack Hawk - Ryan Rhineheart

Server (Sage or Acacia): Sage

Date (MM-DD-YYYY): 11/08/2022

Round Number: 39838

Rules Broken: 2. No power gaming (For Jack) 1. You must roleplay (For Ryan)

Incident Description: The Round is ending, shutle about to leave, i decide to execute my target a little bit outside of the shuttle and the only witness is a medborg(I think maybe Jack since she tried to shake my target), who of course moves to the shuttle to report the crime

I go back to try and take a pod but remember it’s gone so i head back to the shuttle, i’m near chapel (on Box Station) and i get greeted with Jack who starts shooting an energy crossbow at me The mediborg (Station integritry lawset thought he didn’t do anything) and the HoS Ryan wordlessly unloading his shotgun loaded with lethals, in the end since they lost the shuttle, HoS left me for dead in a chair.

Additional Information:

I saw Jack Hack carrying the axe as an engineer on the hallways for quite a lot of time for… no particular reason, in fact i think he had it on his back since he ended up using for EORG, he wasn’t deputized at any point according to Captain and i have no clue how he came into the posession of an energy crossbow other than going into sec and printing it for himself/stealing it from someone, point being that he used to ‘‘hunt le valid’’, in fact even HoS got surprised as he mentioned that he thought it was a mini energy one

HoS arrived super late to the shift, the only report he got was that the Acting Captain was missing

We were on Green alert for the entire duration of the shift (It was kinda scuffed, there was no sec at all and the acting captain barely had time to breath but it’s worth mentioning it)

While i only used a small explosive to kill my target you could argument that i was ‘‘armed and dangerous’’, but in the end the only information the HoS had was that i killed someone, pretty much a hear say, yet i got rushed into chapel and received a full magazine of shotgun + energy bolts.

The HoS has plenty of tools to non-harmfully detain someone and at no point he tried to non-lethally detain me or even talk to me, in the fight i couldn’t even draw a single weapon either so i pretty much didn’t fought back, i’m mostly reporting this behaviour because i’ve seen people noted for doing this.

So we have a case of Jack hunting le valid and HoS over-using lethal force and giving more of an attitude of KILL VALID than attempt a non-lethal arrest or a basic roleplay.

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Oh hey I was the moth paramed, your target. You just sleepy penned me and planted an X4 on me. No words, no intimidation, no nothing, just greentext chasing. So it could be argued that you broke R1, but whatever.
I’m fairly certain the AI or the borg reported you as the criminal, which is why HoS went straight to lethals. And, remember, we had little to no security members and three bombings in total before this, two of which resulted in a massive hull breach.

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Even if the borg reported it, it’s not an excuse go go straight for lethals, as i said, the security personnel have plenty of tools to non-harmfully arrest someone, the round after, 39839 he repeated his behaviour with the validhunty and over-excesive gear.

The HoS wasn’t aware of the bombings and hullbreachs(repaired at that point) as i said before he only got briefed on coms that the Captain was missing(so he had no idea of the traitors who were still loose or which ones were killed).

As for your death, i could’ve played it better that’s true, i disagree in the acussation of greentext chasing, sadly since you’re not omnipotent you only had your POV i played a good round(i’ll save the details since they’re not that relevant) and only trip over at the end with your execution i apologize for making it very scuffed and i’ll try to do better next time with a murder objective.

in all honesty it was almost 7:30 am and my objective got re-rolled pretty late into you and decided to wait for shuttle to hit you, the other syndicate members wanted to do their own thing on shuttle and needed back-up and at the very least we were aware of your IC nuisance against the Syndicate (the pacification of two agents, trying to find cap) So i really wanted to mention something like “Syndicate sends their regards” but then again, too sleep and tired and i forgot.

Opening armory on green and resorting immediately to lethals on individuals who have not shown themselves to have any real weapons, I would not say bombs would count as real weapons to use in combat. Due to attempting to use them will get you killed and you won’t have a window to plant the ones that meed to be planted.

From spacelaw, about use of lethal force: “Criminals in hostile environments such as space, fire, or plasma leaks also fall into this category, as do criminals believed to be in possession of high explosives. Ranged lethal force is the only reasonable option in these conditions.”

If the HoS believed there was explosive involved, then they didnt break any rules, as far as SOP is concerned anyway.

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My bad, i meant to say something like uhh ‘‘easily to jump on to lethals instead of trying to attempt a non-lethal arrest’’ As a matter of fact @WilsonPH got full crit by hulk HoS on the following round that i mentioned above when he had a lot of chances to talk (though i’ll leave the details unless asked to not derail the thread, it’s mostly to point out that it’s a repeated behavior even in the following round)

Though i believe Security players can be charged with validhunter behaviour i’ve seen officers get bwoinked for rushing to a locked dorm room and ask AI to immediatly unbolt it on Green Alert or even them unwelding the wall to take a peek

The thing is Tamus, with all the context there is available his behaviours felt more of KILL VALID NOW than… to attempt a basic level of dialogue or try a non-lethal arrest it’s like the ?shotgun copypasta applies lol, while he might’ve acted on SOP (Even though it was Green alert) he certainly didn’t exchange a word, i got horizontal’d with no chance to even fight back or to speak. It was basically as if i got a Kill on sight bounty on my head and its not like i was wearing a hardsuit with a d-esword and i already had twenty bodies on me

a bomb is a weapon

I get it.
But in the end, you probably committed prime murder by using explosives (depending on what is left of your target).
HoS joins late, learns of a Guy doing prime with explosives…

Overall, i wasnt there and cant add much.
But it s very possible from the HOS pov they did the rigth thing with what they knew and in regards to spacelaw, SOP and common sense.

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The alert level wasn’t raised due to the CE as acting cap being busy literally all the time. Oh and CE got chased by one of the traitors with a syndie hardsuit and an esword into the armory and had a bit of a stand off there. Me and some other people came to watch, even cheered on Armsky when it stunned and cuffed the traitor.
Just adding more context.

Correct, all of that happened iwas one of the people watching iirc though the armory wasn’t fully looted so it pretty much looked ‘‘normal’’

I was acting cap CE. The alert should have been Blue - I just never got the time to set it really. However, Fronsis’ character was not actively wanted (I had spotted them doing petty theft in the detective’s office earlier but was far too busy with the threat of the Chaplain and someone who had just busted into the labor camp teleporter room).
I then died due to the detective (who was also a traitor, thanks dynameme), and saw the sleepy pen + X4 be used however I did not see any of the events involving the HoS or Jack.

HoS joined almost immediately after my death, so I had no opportunity to tell him anything and my body was never recovered.

Hello! i was able to get in touch with the reported players. Once they reply i’ll process this :+1:

Jack Hawk here
There was no sec and acting captain (the only head?) was missing, captain being missing with active syndicate members onboard could mean that entire station was in danger. i thought finding them should be priority above anything else but person that killed captain could be still there so i thought it will be better to get a weapon. i broke into sec and got energy crossbow from illegal tech as non-lethal weapon and cuffs to incapacitate them so i could retrieve the captain, some time later shuttle is called and hos arrived so i PDA them that captain is killed. i hide the crossbow in the backpack (better than throwing it on the ground) and because shuttle was almost there i had no time to bring back the axe so i just bringed it onto the shuttle. then i saw you X4ing someone so i ran to hos to inform them about you. first i wanted to just watch your fight but then i thought “shit, that guy is kinda dangerous. maybe i should help as i have a weapon already so we don’t lose hos too” so i jumped in to help but hos thought that i was second traitor and attacked me (energy crossbow).

TLDR: I deputized myself and hunted valids because sec was nonexistent and only head (captain) was dead from syndicate. if there was sec/heads i would still do my engineering job and don’t care

Also i could twist some facts because it’s hard to remember round that happened ~4 days ago

Thanks for your PoV, i coul make this a little bit lenghty but in the end rules are against validhunting and powergaming, guess we’ll wait for Ryan to say their side and leave Hello to handle it

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The other player said:

Reading through it, I don’t have much else to offer than what has been said. Both Jack’s and Morgan’s perspectives seem correct.

Also, the tot succumbed when I was about to epi-pen him.

they couldn’t post this on forums
Now that everyone offered their side to this report, i’ll process the report :+1:


Even if soemone is busy, raising alert should be the top priority (if the captain can’t, the AI can do it).

What happened:

Jack managed to acquire a crossbow, at the time there was no security and the captain went missing.


The crossbow you get from illegal tech is very powerful. This was the damage caused by two hits:
It’s pretty strong honestly, considering each hit knocks down and deals stamina damage as well

Getting the means to defend yourself is usually fine in situations similar to this one, however this doesn’t mean you can go after the traitors. You’re still a non-military trained regular crewmember.

Jack witnessed the cook place an X4 on someone.
They decide to report this on comms.
The HOS sees the guy who supposedly just blew another person up and starts shooting at them (they were also wearing other syndicate gear, given how dangerous X4 is, it’s justified).

While HOS and traitor were fighting, Jack shoots at the traitor with the crossbow (at the time the traitor had 8 HPs).
Then the HOS shoots at Jack, thinking they were another agent.

The HOS:
Given the circumstances, what they did was justified. Lethal force is allowed if the criminal is in posession of dangerous weapons.

Getting something to defend yourself in this case was understandable, but the weapon they chose was definetly too much for a regular crewmember.
They also used it to attack the traitor, when the HOS was already dealing with them.
They should have let security deal with the situation, as in that moment the traitor wasn’t really a threat to the HOS.
Circumstances were dire, however this behaviour wasn’t justified.

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