Top 5 worst things on lavaland

Preamble

Over the years, I’ve analyzed and discussed mining as deeply as I could’ve, cosidering it was a great timewaster for me. The most in-depth post I made was likely the full rework document, a piece which contained bits like the public access gateway and mob ore drops (this one only made it to bosses, though). Of course, by now some parts of that doc are outdated.

The main issue with that kind of post was that it was too comprehensive. The only way to ever get it done reasonably would be to separate it into a ton of different, smaller changes.

Now, with that in mind, I shall simply list the top 5 worst things in lavaland. Literally, the hit list for anyone (including myself) who wants to make it better. I’m curious about what other people think, do they have aspects that frustrate them more than what I’ve listed, and would they want something done about it? I’m also curious about whether a PR changing any of this would actually get accepted, so if you’re in the coder mafia, I’d love to hear your take as well.

So, the list begins:

1. Squint

Squint? Squint. Ever walked through an empty area, opened up the text box to reply to something, and watched as three goliaths suddenly attacked you? Ever walked through a storm only to instantly get round removed? These two - goliaths and abyss - are incredibly frustrating because they encourage glaring at your screen like you’re Medusa hearing footsteps in her lair. You will get punished for not looking hard enough, and the punishment is probably death. Now, staring with intensity into your screen is not only annoying, but it’s also genuinely unhealthy. I’ve seen people complain about these two on their own, but it also goes a step further as a personal fuck you to the colorblind (of which I am a part, but luckily not for the colors used here). It is not only disrespectful but seemingly designed to be frustrating on purpose.

The fix: Make goliaths brighter. Replace abyss /w lava.

2. Mined too deep

Gibtonite seems fine on paper, right? Just be careful while you mine, and everything will be fine. Problems become far more apparent when one analyzes the effects of its actual existence versus what it actually accomplishes. A big part of this is also tied to how mining scanners work - namely pulsing.

Pros of gibtonite: You can mine a bit faster roundstart, you can make explosives.

Cons of gibtonite: Sonic jackhammer and diamond drill are unusable. Running through unscanned areas from a boss can randomly kill you. Fighting most bosses in general can randomly kill you (max strength gibtonite activated offscreen), lag can randomly kill you while mining, mining with a friend can randomly kill you.

Overall, despite seeming well designed on paper, all gibtonite seems to contribute beyond getting you explosive access is killing miners in unfair ways.

The fix: Change the mechanics outright. Maybe gibtonite just drops normally and using a scanner on it is what sets it off. Maybe it drops shards you combine into a big bomb like I originally came up with. Maybe something completely different, or just remove it and call it a mining nerf, lol.

3. Get down

Using two cores is actually extremely inconsistent, because it’s a disease codewise. What does this mean really? I’ve experienced the following from core overdose:
• Getting infected, seeing only early stage warnings, and getting removed within 30 seconds.
• Getting infected, seeing warnings for over 2 minutes, and having enough time to calmly walk to station and ask for a brain transplant.
• Getting cured instantly from one plant.
• Eating to the fat cap and still not getting cured, being forced to seek alternative treatment.

In other words, it feels almost random…and maybe it is? I don’t know what the actual mechanics here are, but logic tells me that it’s the disease code, namely the stats, that aren’t always the same.

The fix: Take your pick, make the disease stats always the same if they aren’t, or turn it into an actual debuff, maybe one that needs a more direct fix than vitrium froth (from the mining vendor maybe).

4. You get nothing

Breather entry. Mining still has items worthless for miners in the loot pool, coupled with horrible boss drops. Let’s analyze some stuff.
• Cursed heart is so annoying that everyone universally ignores it.
• Meat hook is only good for antags and security, the latter of which avoids it because it is technically lethal, so literally just an antag item.
• The heck suit is the only bubblegum drop, and worse than drake armor for lack of being a real spacesuit and having the random jumpscare mechanic.
• The voice of god has zero actual mining use, relegating it for gimmick ideas or powergame only.
• Jackhammer gloves are actively detrimental due to gibtonite.

The fix: First, remove cursed heart. From there, it’s a matter of minor changes. Letting you pick between two items when you open chests would honestly fix most of this. As for the heck suit, letting a chaplain purify it for jumpscare removal and maybe spaceworthiness would add some rp while letting you get a real reward. Colossus definitely needs to actually drop something else though. Time to port some item, eh?

5. Unintentional bait?

Two words: Kinetic Crusher. It’s allegedly there to be a hard mode item, and the achievements support this, but the concept of running mining on hard mode was destroyed when trophies were added to regular boss drops. Now that we have those, crusher has become more about being a lategame powerhouse after you’ve dealt with a few bosses. Sure, saw outclasses it, but there’s more than one miner. This leaves the crusher with a bizarre identity - best to be ignored until at least mid-round, and then it’s suddenly competitive?

The fix: Honestly, buff the crusher. Meleeing mobs and bosses is hard and requires you to learn a lot of patterns, and beestation has shifted away from a combat focus over the years. Hard mode be damned, but our miners should be given the option to enjoy such things as a one-handed crusher that fits on a belt slot, or some real trophy effects that make it worth getting early (as it stands, only legion skull has a tangible effect from regular mobs, and I’ve also heard that the bubblegum trophy is dysfunctional). I’d like to bring up effects like stacking up destabilizing force up several times or being able to charge or parry as potential crusher moves to make it compete with the sheer damage of the saw.

Thanks for read, remember to like, comment and shrubscribe.

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start lavaland all over again by moving it to space :slight_smile:

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1000101563

Miners forgetting that they aren’t the only ones on lavaland.

also this sounds like a skill issue

There used to be more boss drops, but they got removed (for god knows why).
Last I recall PowerfulBacon wants to remove Lavaland overall and make it tied to Exploration. In result making all of the suggestions for lavaland improvements irrelevant.

#Buffmining

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There used to be more boss drops, but they got removed (for god knows why).

A lot of the drops were bullshit. I was there when they existed and they generally just attracted griefers to the department. The problem was removing without replacement.

Last I recall PowerfulBacon wants to remove Lavaland overall and make it tied to Exploration.

Tying it to exploration would kinda kill the job and I think he knows this, but space mining as a concept, not specifically tied to explo, was discussed many times and could be great if properly implemented.

Realistically though, this thread is top 5 worst things on lavaland, not top 5 reasons to remove lavaland.

also this sounds like a skill issue

Most deaths are a skill issue, but that doesn’t make them equal. Say, 10% skill 90% bullshit of getting gibtonited offscreen into lava, vs 100% skill of just dying to a boss normally.

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Bonus entry: Linda

If you break a wall on the mining base linda will try to suck you into that tile from inside repeatedly, but only if you’re next to it. If there’s lava on that tile, it makes a deathtrap that kills anyone who tries to fix the breach from inside.

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Most of these do sound like a skill issue of a very specific variety: Slow down a bit/look before you leap.

If you’re ever hoofing it through a storm you ignored that a storm was coming, or were so far into the planet you should be keeping tabs on and making shortcuts to shelters or carrying your own.

Goliaths only attack the turn after they move as they move a second time, and on a delay at that. This requires them to have line of sight which means visible to you when they moved. I can understand wandering into one unexpectedly while you’re moving but not the typing situation unless you are staring at keyboard while typing.

Mining into gibtonite because you are mining too fast in a straight line is not unfair, use additional scanners or control your mining speed to the areas you have scanned.

Crusher drops were added to boss loot because miners using a crusher would get huffy and ultra defensive if they weren’t soloing the bosses. This encouraged them to be more willing to work as a team - I do agree it could be buffed but it’s already quite strong even at round start once you get used to it. It even mines faster than base pka before upgrades for a little boost there.

Unrelated to skill issues, the disease is static stats, but all diseases cure randomly based on those stats and the presence of what cures them.

Explaining how things work doesn’t really make them any better.

One must remember that reverse evidence isn’t really trustworthy. ie, just because you can prevent something doesn’t make its threat nonexistent (or fair).

However I do commend the post for giving proper advice like having extra scanners.

Fine, then I’ll only mention one thing. Swarmer beacon.

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remember what they took from us…

Blood Hunts

I don’t think any of this is “unfair” and mining is not supposed to be free of threats.

Some of it is learned by messing up the first time, but it isn’t unfair to give someone a tool that can mine at insane speeds and expect them to use it responsibly instead of blindly rushing beyond the range of their scanner.

Gibtonite is really fun and being dangerous is part of the fun imo. This is true for mining as a whole, being dangerous is an integral part of the job flavor.

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Iunno man, you can argue git gud about most things, doesn’t mean all deaths are equal, but I also didn’t wanna argue about things to begin with in this thread so it’s good.

Maybe it’s time to bring out the Wendigo…

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