Ravellon Admin Report

CKEY: BlueScope

Offender’s CKEY: Ravellon

LRP or MRP server: MRP

Date (MM-DD-YYYY): 07-20-2020

Round Number: 18776

Part of Admin Conduct Broken (if relevant): Refusal to enforce or acknowledge MRP rules 13 and 14.

Incident Description:
I played a Detective that shift. When I saw someone breaking Space Law, I set them to arrest, and updated their records. About three quarters of the way into the shift, the Head of Security asked why half the station was set to arrest - and I explained the above to him. He stated that he had no interest in exploring, or handing any of the breaches in Space Law that I had tracked. I then cryo’d, after some mutual name-calling, and made an ahelp. Ravellon responded.
I was initially informed, that - because I called the HoS some names, he was fully within his rights to ignore Space Law, and to not enforce it.
A long conversation between Ravellon and myself ensued, as I tried to probe the matter - curious as to why a HoS that has no interest in enforcing Space Law wasn’t in breach of rule 13.
The general result of this conversation, as far as my impression goes - is that the HoS is not required to actually enforce Space Law - at his discretion, according to Ravellon.
Note that I had updated many records, and set many people to arrest, prior to the station falling to shit due to observably active antagonists. I additionally pointed out how this might be a Rule 14 violation - though didn’t emphasize that.
I stated my general impression before I had to go - based on what Ravellon had said - that Ravellon did not view a HoS who does not enforce Space Law is fully within their rights, and that the only way a HoS would be in breach of Rule 13 is if they refused to valid hunt.

Additional Information:
Nothing against Ravellon. It’s hard to have a coherent conversation while dealing with ahelps, and via tickets. I’d like his thoughts here on the matter.
I additionally cited a specific instance regarding the HoS. The Virologist that shift had utilized a disease with a symptom which caused tentacles to randomly rise around them, and harm the crew - with zero direct control of the manifestation of these tentacles. I also witnessed them offering this disease to the crew. I set them to arrest, updated their record, and announced that they were a priority arrest over the Security channel - which the HoS acknowledged. Five seconds later, the Virologist appeared outside of Security, with the HoS present in the same location. I requested the HoS arrest them, and received no response.
I presented this as an example of the HoS violating Rule 13 to Ravellon - who then debated with me on why a symptom that causes random AOE damage to players isn’t harmful.

1 Like

The tentacles are goliath tentacles, just stun no damage done.
Is it a workplace hazard: Yes.
Should you arrest them: Yes.

Should half the station be set to arrest: No.

This seems much more like an IC issue unless the HoS was doing absolutely nothing all round.

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I’d have to research if they just stun, I recall that when I was particularly attacked by one - it did do damage. I very well might be mistaken.

Still, a HoS that does not enforce Space Law is in violation of a rule, if not two. If I’m mistaken in that impression as well, I’d like the specifics explained. This thread serves that purpose, more than anything - which is why I requested Ravellon’s comment.

The tl;dr is that people were set to arrest before shit hit the fan, and the HoS did nothing. I commented on this to Ravellon, who also did nothing.

If the HoS was responding to more serious threats, then I’d understand why they weren’t doing minor arrests.

However, If they weren’t doing anything as a head, they would likely be running afoul of the head competency rule on MRP.

In this case they weren’t goliath tentacles, they were something else and did cause brute damage.

That is what I am asserting, yes.

I think zeskorion was just trying to prove a point about how virologist is completely broken.

Researched a bit. Per this file, line 134 - the tentacles caused from that disease symptom support my initial hypothesis - in that they do cause damage.

That’s semantics, really - again - I’m complaining because there was a HoS explicitly not doing their job, and Rav did nothing about it. The fact that I had to argue the point until I was blue in the face, instead of them just saying “Okay, I’ll look into it” - and then asking the HoS if they had enforced Space Law that shift before shit hit the fan - is rather disheartening. Being brushed off with numerous rationalizations was also very frustrating. Again - absolutely nothing against Rav. MRP is very seldom enforced on MRP. I’m probably the only one bitching about it.

A certain degree of competency is required from the HoS on MRP, this is in the rules, if he allows people to blatantly do illegal things that he could have easily had tried to stop, he most certainly deserves at least a note for it. That’s just my 50 cents.

That’s my argument, yes. Some kind of action would’ve been nice, on Rav’s part. I made this instead of a Player Report, because I shouldn’t have needed to make a Player Report, as there was an admin online to enforce the rule.
Picking and choosing what aspects of Space Law to enforce at a time when there’s no critical danger is a Rule 13 (and 14) violation. Vandalism, for example, is still vandalism. If you want to just slap them with a citation, then do that. Don’t do nothing.

EDIT: The frequent logic behind Rav’s lack of action was the HoS was just being “lazy”. That was very frustrating. It’d be childish to quote the rules as presented on the wiki and the rules page to the staff, so I won’t. The lack of MRP enforcement on Sage is even more frustrating. The staff generally just seem to not care.

1 Like

In my opinion, this should be a player report with a specific note that the admin online at the time didn’t think it was actionable.

There were more serious issues than a virologist with hazardous but contained virus effects.
Virologist also wasn’t offering necroseed to the crew, he offered them a different one because “they couldn’t handle the power”

On blue alert a seemingly cooperative viro that has made an effort not to create any contagious diseases, that haven’t made any death plagues and that offers beneficial viruses to others is not much of a threat.
Add to that a detective that demands this viro’s arrest and when HoS, his superior, doesn’t do so calls said HoS a retard and dumb fuck - HoS not taking said detective seriously and focusing on what he, the HoS, considers a more important issue sounds sensible to me.

The more important issue in question was the clusterfuck of Cargonia buying a bunch of guns without authorisation but not quite rebelling.

Yes, HoS wasn’t very enthusiastic about enforcing Space Law. He let what he considered minor offenses slide. He did not abandon his duties entirely however. So not ideal. But good enough, in my view.

If that was faulty judgement, I’ll keep that in mind for the future.

2 Likes

That does explain it then, the original post made it sound like the HoS was completely disregarding all space law, if he did in fact attempt to perform his duties elsewhere on the station, that’s fine. The virologist did in fact not spread his disease nor hurt anyone on purpose.

1 Like

Yes, Cargo did eventually order guns. Eventually. There was a very generous half hour to forty five minutes with - as I said above - no observably active antagonists. The Viro was just one example, of many. To be absolutely clear - at one point the HoS explicitly said that because I’d set people too many who were confirmed for breaking Space Law to arrest, that he wasn’t going to do anything about any of them.

I feel like you haven’t addressed a lot of the general points I’ve made. The core point remains - people broke Space Law. I pointed this out to the HoS. The HoS did nothing. I boinked Rav about the HoS doing nothing. Rav did nothing.

The entirety of security is:

  • HoS
  • Warden
  • Detective

Detective does their job of investigating the station, reporting and logging crimes + updating arrest records, a total of only eight players were set to arrest, and all with detailed and valid crimes. As a detective, they are not equipped to arrest and also told via roundstart blurb that they aren’t expected or supposed to arrest.

All arrest records set by bluescope

03:11:33 [mob_385] (125,142,2) || Dave Kesseli New Minor Crime: 210 - B&E: Corporate Showroom. Witnessed by D. Bonds. | Added to Dave Kesseli by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds)
03:11:37 [mob_385] (125,142,2) || Dave Kesseli Neutrino431/(Dave Kesseli) has been set from None to Arrest by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds).

03:28:05 [mob_397] (120,121,2) || Imhotep-Rich-Blood New Minor Crime: 201 - B&E: Gateway. Witnessed by D.Bonds. | Added to Imhotep-Rich-Blood by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds)
03:28:10 [mob_397] (120,121,2) || Imhotep-Rich-Blood Brother_jeff/(Imhotep-Rich-Blood) has been set from None to Arrest by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds).

03:34:59 [0x2008c67] (124,162,2) || the security records console New Minor Crime: 107 - Vandalism: Destroyed a vending machine. Evidence on file with D. Bonds. | Added to Algernon D. Guerrero by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds)
03:35:03 [0x2008c67] (124,162,2) || the security records console Algernon D. Guerrero has been set from None to Arrest by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds).

03:38:02 [mob_399] (132,112,2) || Danni Lebonski New Minor Crime: 107 - Vandalism: Spread Glowshrooms. When asked to clean them up, responded “Naw”. Witnessed/Interrogator - D. Bonds. | Added to Danni Lebonski by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds)
03:38:08 [mob_399] (131,112,2) || Danni Lebonski Dannyjake1234/(Danni Lebonski) has been set from None to Arrest by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds).

03:42:05 [0x2008c67] (124,162,2) || the security records console New Major Crime: 310 - B&E, Restricted: Vault. Witnessed by D. Bonds. When asked what they were doing, responded “Fuck”, and closed the Vault door. Likely also has unauthorized access, indicating a 311. | Added to Neil Jones by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds)
03:42:09 [0x2008c67] (124,162,2) || the security records console Neil Jones has been set from None to Arrest by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds).

03:45:05 [0x2008c67] (124,162,2) || the security records console New Major Crime: 304 - Weapon Posession: Plasma Cutter. Witnessed by Research Director, Jimmy Falkner. | Added to Alexandre Schmidt by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds)
03:45:28 [0x2008c67] (124,162,2) || the security records console New Minor Crime: 210 - B&E: Research. Witnessed by Research Director, Jimmy Falkner. | Added to Alexandre Schmidt by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds)
03:45:31 [0x2008c67] (124,162,2) || the security records console Alexandre Schmidt has been set from None to Arrest by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds).

03:47:26 [mob_395] (89,142,2) || Eyre I Zeskorion/(Eyre I) has been set from None to Arrest by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds).
03:48:02 [mob_395] (97,143,2) || Eyre I New Major Crime: 302 - Assault, Officer: Created a disease which casuses him to generate tentacles, several of which harmed D. Bonds, Detective. | Added to Eyre I by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds)
03:48:42 [mob_395] (105,159,2) || Eyre I New Major Crime: 311 - Dereliction of Duty: Created harmful dieases, offered to spread them to the crew. | Added to Eyre I by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds)

03:51:23 [0x2008c67] (124,162,2) || the security records console New Major Crime: 308 - Theft: Security Officer Rob Rockwell’s ID card. | Added to Catboy Rapist by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds)
03:51:26 [0x2008c67] (124,162,2) || the security records console Catboy Rapist has been set from None to Arrest by BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds).

From say logs I can see there were no apparent threats to the station yet, so yes this definitely looks like an HoS not taking their job seriously to me. I understand there being some room for IC grudges to be held, especially with the detective directly insulting the HoS, but the HoS commented on players being set to arrest several times and not acting on it.

Timeline on the HoS, including being bwoinked for a 10 minute brig timer on the one player arrested and brought to them

[2020-07-20 03:09:57.242] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “okay im the hos” (Arrival Shuttle (48, 139, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:10:05.423] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “shit will go very wrong” (Arrival Shuttle (48, 139, 2))

[2020-07-20 03:12:56.931] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “Yeah, Kesseli is wanted for B&E, by the way.” (Central Primary Hallway (102, 115, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:13:14.674] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “Stop breaking shit.” (Central Primary Hallway (126, 132, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:14:50.005] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “uuh” (Brig (111, 166, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:14:53.169] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “shit” (Brig (111, 166, 2))

[2020-07-20 03:15:45.889] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “yo” (Prison Wing (87, 184, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:15:47.739] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “Yep?” (Port Primary Hallway (86, 139, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:15:52.143] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “its the training one” (Prison Wing (87, 184, 2))
(playing with training bomb)

[2020-07-20 03:17:05.681] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “He turned himsef in though” (Brig (109, 165, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:17:08.260] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “So take that into account” (Brig (109, 164, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:17:12.099] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “uh” (Brig (112, 165, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:17:18.822] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “I'l head to the kitchen to confirm prints for the attempted gibbing.” (Brig (109, 165, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:17:25.662] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “get em in there” (Brig (110, 166, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:17:31.931] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “10 minutes” (Brig (110, 166, 2))

[2020-07-20 03:19:57.074] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “Yeah, I witnessed Kesseli's crime. Details in his file.” (Central Primary Hallway (89, 143, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:19:57.553] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “if you find any goodies” (Gateway (119, 119, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:20:01.497] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “bring it to me” (Gateway (119, 119, 2))

[2020-07-20 03:28:29.024] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan)->RiskySikh/(Bindy Johal): well, the detective just told us what he did, i didnt check for any evidence
[2020-07-20 03:28:43.698] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan)->RiskySikh/(Bindy Johal): sorry mate, its my first time as a hos
(Getting bwoinked because they brigged the mime for 10 minutes)

[2020-07-20 03:40:26.247] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “Got someone unuathorized in the Vault.” (Central Primary Hallway (99, 145, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:40:29.191] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “Might want to get on that.” (Central Primary Hallway (99, 145, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:40:45.595] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “and crime is low” (Bridge (111, 138, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:40:48.823] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “well” (Bridge (111, 138, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:41:01.078] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “we are at 90%” (Bridge (111, 138, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:41:13.394] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “aaand” (Bridge (104, 138, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:41:17.105] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “no one's dead” (Bridge (104, 138, 2))

[2020-07-20 03:44:20.529] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “why the hell is the hop set to arrest” (Brig (106, 165, 2))

[2020-07-20 03:48:46.600] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “whats with the kinky tendrils” (Fore Primary Hallway (107, 160, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:48:52.898] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “Viro is a bad dude, high priority arrest target.” (Central Primary Hallway (91, 144, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:49:04.773] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “jesus” (Fore Primary Hallway (107, 160, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:49:09.674] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “Creating harmful diseases.” (Central Primary Hallway (110, 145, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:49:11.323] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “what is the request” (Fore Primary Hallway (109, 160, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:49:21.548] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “offering to spread said harmful diseases to the crew.” (Central Primary Hallway (110, 145, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:49:23.704] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “hm” (Fore Primary Hallway (109, 160, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:49:28.456] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “sounds reasonable” (Fore Primary Hallway (110, 160, 2))

[2020-07-20 03:49:43.099] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “Officer.” (Fore Primary Hallway (108, 154, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:49:47.177] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “That lad is set to arrest, so arrest him.” (Fore Primary Hallway (108, 154, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:49:49.130] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “Fuck.” (Fore Primary Hallway (108, 154, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:50:17.763] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “What the fuck, Officer.” (Fore Primary Hallway (108, 156, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:50:27.543] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “Also, where is your ID?” (Fore Primary Hallway (108, 156, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:50:39.191] SAY: BlueScope/(Dorian Bonds) “Fuck's sake.” (Fore Primary Hallway (108, 156, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:51:38.212] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “aight” (Xenobiology Lab (127, 65, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:51:56.441] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “half of the station is set to arrest for some reason” (Xenobiology Lab (127, 65, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:52:03.181] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “i aint arresting em” (Xenobiology Lab (127, 65, 2))

[2020-07-20 03:52:43.178] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “xeno” (Xenobiology Lab (131, 62, 2))
[2020-07-20 03:52:49.589] SAY: Jonypotato/(Kal-Deetsan) “i want a golem for myself” (Xenobiology Lab (131, 62, 2))

In conclusion:
This was the first time this player was HoS, but they weren’t even fit to be a regular security officer from the looks of things. No knowledge of space law or brigging procedure in general, no interest shown in actually doing the job of a security officer, blatantly ignoring folks set to arrest and even declaring that they wouldn’t take part in it.

Yeah I’d say the situation could have been handled differently and the HoS was acting grossly incompetent shown via chat logs by the point the ahelp was made. I don’t necessarily agree with this being a fault of Ravellon so much as misjudging the situation though.

1 Like

yeah. that’s pretty bad, the guy (not admin) definitely needs a secban

Yeah, I guess this is my bad. This does look worse than it appeared to me at the time.

everyone makes mistakes, and stuff like this is why you’re a trialmin. But yeah that guy needs a secban

Absolutely no worries, Rav. I hate to discourage people from volunteering their time. If there was something less than the nuclear option of an Admin Report, and something more than the wet fart of making an Admin Feedback post - I’d happily have done that instead.

1 Like

There’s player report, but I don’t really mind. What’s the point of trying if you can’t be wrong?