Pretty cool idea I’m probably going to code up after @PowerfulBacon finishes the frankly radical rev softening PR.
My idea is that, while still being antags and having reasons to throw bombs and molotovs at sec, there’s no longer always a reason for revs to RR the entire sec and command teams.
The below options would essentially be reskins of the conversion text, with different splash texts and goals.
Animal Rights Activists
Objective: Free all the animals! Including xenobio slimes and monkeys!
There could be mention of some places that might be better for the animals; the holodeck (assuming you’d set the holodeck to one of the nice settings like beach or that one with the grass?) Or maybe let them go outside on echo, or ship them off on a cargo shuttle to a co-conspirator on centcom?
Anti-work Action
Objective: Laze around doing anything but your job at bar, react aggressively to people trying to get you back to work.
Living Wage Movement
Objective: Double the pay/increase pay for all non-command staff.
Hippie Psychonaut Movement
Spend as much time stoned/tripping/tweaking as possible.
Maybe Borrow/Buy/Steal a chem dispenser and accoutrements? Maybe set up a maintenance botany area? Imagine the RP opportunities!
Workers revolution
Objective: Standard Revs. More violent, kill heads, replace them, etc.
Can you think of any other flavor of commie? I’m serious, I’m looking for ideas.
1 Like
I never intend for people to stop killing all of sec/command, it was just a really quick and simple change to make it so revs doesn’t stall for an eternity once the shuttle is called. Players won’t be banned for RR’ing security or command. This was just a bare minimum change to make it so that the part of revs that is complete ass is alright, since the actual material of most revs rounds usually ends up being somewhat interesting. (It wasn’t a PR that I really care all that much about, I just made it because something needed to be done)
I might change the objective to be something like have an [ X ] approval rate among non-mindshielded people or something like that.
1 Like
The idea being that while still being antags and having reasons to throw bombs and molotovs at sec, there’s no longer a reason to RR the entire sec and command teams
That was meat to be talking about my idea, not your PR, apologies.
What do you think about the alternate goals idea?
I think that giving revs a goal which can’t be hindered by a known target hiding is a good idea (cult gets away with this by having a random, unknowable target; but a static area objective works too), but it will be difficult to make objectives that maintain the feel of the gamemode being a large number of underpowered workers fighting a smaller group of highly geared security/command personnel.
1 Like
Hmm, fair. Then again the vibe of being part of a makeshift riot fighting the power doesn’t necessarily have to be direct targeted killing of heads. Security will surely still interpose themselves if a large group are breaking into science or genetics to free monkeys, breaking into the hop office for pay increases, etc.
It opens up the opportunity for rich rp that’s a little more complicated than “NT bad”. We might actually see command trying to negotiate, we might actually see demonstrations that start nonviolent.
I think it’s worth a try!
1 Like
I agree its worth a try, but a lot of objectives might need to be cut and its probably better to not have too many since otherwise it will take a long time to weed out the bad ones. The crimes need to be serious enough that it actually justifies security taking heavy action, otherwise it will just become a greytide station where people are releasing animals but security don’t have the authorisation to go round and start taking drastic action such as mindshielding everyone. As a general guideline for the objectives, I would think they would need to all be something that warrants a dramatic security response and authorisation of forced mindshielding. Good objective design is surprisingly difficult, and most end up becoming a variation of assassination because killing someone has good seriousness, is a relatively open objective in how you go about completing it and is pretty obvious once somebody has completed it.
I think the biggest blocker in revolution is mindshields, anyone with a mindshield is not allowed to side with the revs. The best improvement to RP in rev rounds would be a complete removal of mindshields and allowing security to choose to side with the revs once they achieve their goals, but that probably won’t happen since it would change a lot of other things too.
Also the fact that the station will never return to normal after revs take over, although we are more concerned about the revolution than the actual aftermath of the revolution (The aftermath in the game is going to be shuttle called and everyone escapes).
2 Likes
Good point about the objectives. So what I’m hearing is, to maintain viability as a game mode revolution needs to be serious enough for mass sec action and have a clear completion point, if only for the antags to aim for.
Hmm… But does rev have to be a mass sec action threat? Is there no other way to prevent the antagonists being reduced to greytiders? As it stands the closest to that failure state are some low rp lowpop traitor players, and they have clear goals set, they just choose to play that way despite more interesting options being available.
If it needs to be something violent, to spur security crack-downs, i can see some of these having “kill X role” being a factor. Killing geneticists or xenobiologists for the animal rights version, for instance. Any thoughts?
I guess it comes down to how far we’re willing to change the core idea of what the revolution game mode is meant to be.
For instance on the antiwork version idea, having the round turn a little bit more greenshift because everyone’s flaking on their jobs, only for an automated announcement to tell security to crack down on lazy bums, sounds like an interesting situation that will feel organic. It even plays into server cultural norms a little as well.
1 Like
These ideas will need refined and expanded upon as I’m currently in the office and on mobile:
I quite firmly believe there should be something for rev heads to easily communicate to their followers, whether a secret radio channel or something. Ive personally been, and witnessed, heads be captured, scream for an uprising to free them (because it’ll be RR) and nothing is done. Also witnessed rev heads try their hardest to organise the crowd but nobody listens which plays heavily into the stalemate
I also hink it should be a thing instead of RR the head revs, they need to be held in brig for a period of time until they lose their “motivation” (could be done through the kinda propganda stuff that Ambiic mentioned in a forum post) and it stops RR for revs.
Aka., head rev captured, resists mindshield/spacelaw head thump, so they go to get interrogated and fed NT propoganda.
I feel that would give revs a reason to gear up and storm security to either kill the heads and/or free the head rev.
Again, needs refined and i’ll do it once I get home if I remember.
2 Likes
They should be kept as political prisoners, yeah.
5 years in solitary confinement with no charges filed >:)
1 Like
Honestly, I find the ideas in this thread pretty meh - but a way to command everyone as a rev ?
Like, being able to send messages to everyone without needing to be in range, but without being able to receive info back to them.
This would buff revs a lot, yeah - and there’d need to be other things changed so as to counteract this (maybe make their flashing have a cooldown so they can’t just go in hallways and spam them?)
BUT this would allow revs to coordinate properly and be able to do proper roleplay.
Right now, if you get turned into a rev, you either follow the revhead or get left behind to powergame and hunt on your own. It’s why a lot of people feel a lack of RP - you don’t really get to have any directions or info on what to do despite being incentivised to take up arms and join the fight. That sucks. A lot.
Having something like this? Yeah it’d be strong, but it’d effectively allow revheads to organise things like RP strikes or cargonia without revs wandering around, getting lost as to what to do and when to attack. It’d effectively allow for the NRP parts of revs to be countered.
Again, the lack of goals is really what sucks. Being able to know “Ah yeah, the head is doing x gimmick” or “oh, they finally started attacking at med, guess it’s time for me to head there and join in the fight !” would help so much in fixing so many of this gamemode’s problems IMO, and would help prevent revs seeing a secoff and thinking “time to go unga ig, the revhead is probably already fighting them”
Yeah, exactly. The few times I’ve been rev head I’ve never once gotten people co-ordinated no matter how hard I try.
I’ve screamed for assistance, shouted to organise at cargo/medbay, etc. to no avail. Even when theres a bunch together its so chaotic they don’t listen. Can’t really blame anyone because everyone is talking or doing stuff, but a way to get attention would be better and allow for more organisation and less stalemate.
1 Like
Yeah, Bacon’s PR to “remove rev objective” was trying to adress the problem of revs not knowing what to do and deciding to just go unga, but all it did was give them even less knowledge of what to do - the way to fix this would be to give revs a way to talk to everyone. I also feel like being able to have a loud voice transmission but without feedback/info wouldn’t be too OP and fun to deal with
For a shittier idea, give them the voice of god that only works on the revs so they can do “SILENCE” and command a crowd
Referring to the actual topic matter, the OP’s post -
These are all so gimmicky that they’d perfectly fit as a midround antag called “social movement” or something.
But revs are a gamemode which costs a lot of threat points, it has to have a huge impact on the round - and stealing pets or asking for increased pay does not constitute as a proper threat
Haven’t seen a rev round for a while, huh?
I did, that’s a tactic I used once, I felt shame for doing it
No I mean the conversion isn’t a flash anymore, it’s a speech.
Oh right, didn’t try bacon’s stuff at all yet
