[Brille65] Unban appeal Hawks-The-Eyes [whyiscaeciliustaken]

Title: [Brille65] Unban appeal Hawks-The-Eyes [whyiscaeciliustaken]

CKEY: Brille65

Admin’s CKEY: whyiscaeciliustaken

Is this for both servers or just one? If so, which one: both

Which server did the ban happen on? Sage [MRP]

Ban Type: Serverban

Ban Length: Perm-ban

Ban Date (MM/DD/YYYY): 01-23-2021

Round ID: 26363

Ban Reason: Horribly toxic behaviour in every round they’re in. Extremely rude to anyone and everyone, regularly wishing death on others IRL for incompetence in-game. Has been banned from several other servers for the same behaviour and hasn’t changed in hundreds of hours in game. Don’t come back.

Appeal Reason: Hello. I’d kindly ask for an unban from BeeStation. I realize that I’ve been an asshole often enough and that I’ve taken out my frustration on people ingame. This is not correct. Even if you might find this funny or implausible, I have … recognized … and now I do a kind of meditation when I notice that the anger is rising in me.
I played on the server for many hours and would like to be able to play again, also because I got to know some nice people who I don’t usually meet.
I hope you have one last mercy on me … Thank you in advance.

Additional Information:

4 Likes

I remember playing with you a while ago, you were a CMO and I was a doctor, and asking if you needed help manufacturing a vaccine as you were my boss. You told me to ‘choke on your tail’ which was uncalled for. When I called you out on your behaviour in LOOC your response was equally toxic, and you responded with something very close to “Sorry I’m not politically correct enough for you”.

I feel like I’ve had my fair share of experience of playing with you. Not only are you incredibly toxic (at least in Medbay), the majority of interactions I saw you have with other players involves you cussing them out and insulting them for minor mistakes, or being new at the job. I’ve never seen you simply doing your job without cussing people out and wishing death threats on them, from round start to round end. I think another side of this issue is that your behavior makes for a boring, one- note character who doesn’t allow anyone to engage with them in meaningful or interesting RP

You frequently assume the role of a department head, as CMO or RD, yet you never actually direct your people, instead complaining about how ‘you have to do everything yourself’ despite there being multiple qualified people to do what you have to do. It becomes a problem when you’re the boss of everyone, but nobody wants to talk to their boss because they a)are a raging asshole and b)stonewall you at every opportunity.

I think the last two paragraphs here show why being in the same department as you is a fucking nightmare. You’re a raging asshole, you make the game less fun for people, and to be completely honest I often felt I had to avoid interacting with you as a player, even if it meant me taking a different job.

I feel like this ban appeal doesn’t show an awareness of just how bad your behaviour was. Also, considering how you were quite aware of your behaviour in your past, the fact that you refused to change it and even taunted me for it (and other people, looking at your post history on this forum), I don’t think think this ban appeal is sufficient.

That said, you’re clearly young, which I think explains some of your behaviour, but it doesn’t excuse it. I do believe people deserve second chances and opportunities to improve themselves, and I think you deserve a chance, despite the many chances you’ve seemingly had on other servers. I think a vouch for good behaviour from another server would be a good place to start, perhaps considering your history with other servers you could ask to be unbanned somewhere else first, or perhaps if the admins would allow it you could ask for a vouch of good behaviour from another server on a different video game?

All things considered, I think this player needs to show a deeper understanding of their behavior and update their post to include how/why they are going to change it. I know I myself am still a relatively new player to the bee community, but I genuinely believe sincerely encouraging Brille to work on their anger and behavioral issues would be a positive thing to do, and it would give them the opportunity to work on themselves while being aware of the fact that they are on very thin ice and that it’s not difficult for someone to make a player report if they have grievances with the player. I think if this player is allowed on the server again they should not be allowed to play head of staff roles.

A final piece of advice to the OP - You need to be committed to changing yourself - if you’re not it won’t happen.

Sorry for the wall of text, guess I just wanted to offer my thoughts on this situation.

4 Likes

Out of all my playtime on Bee, I have a single positive experience with Brille. It was a lowpop MRP round where there weren’t any miners. Brille was ranting on radio about the lack of materials. As the QM, I personally went down to lavaland and dug up ores for bluespace miners, to which he seemed genuinely surprised and thankful. It was kind of surprising, honestly, because every other experience with him has either been seeing him berate other people, being berated by him, or flying under the radar. Worse than all that, he is the only person on Bee that (at least regularly) wishes actual, physical, real-life harm on people. Needs help from an actual licensed professional, not meditation.

1 Like

Thanks for your Reply.

Well, its always easy to talk about a person when you only see the negative aspects. In fact when playing a Head role i try to keep the department & station together as best as possible. in the many hours of being CMO i learned that people barely do as i say. Hell, even when i treat a patient everyone (Including random Assistants that walk in there) thinks he knows things a billion times better than me and even start to fight with me (physically, not with words). Since i Know How painful it is to just get ignored as corpse in the middle of Medbay, i try to avoid that and treat the patients as fast and effective as possible.
Same thing when i am the RD. Trying my best to rush T4 tech to upgrade the station. I often do ask Xeno for slime cell batterys. in maybe 10% of the cases i ask i actually get even a respond. So yea. I mostly have to do anything myself, because on the other hand if i dont do it, everyone quickly starts to shit at me for allegedly doing nothing against Insert Problem here.
Since i felt, in those situations, unfair treated i did “let the asshole part out”, tried to limit it against people who actually caused it but probably failed often enough.

@Halinder
Yeah the “material rant” became a thing because it used to be that miners just simply do nothing whole shift over and when you are in Science department some resources are actually needed to, well, do your job. Since licenses Professionals are all booked out with Suicidal-Persons I think this wont be a option for a long time also i think that my method works pretty well… Wish I’d have done that earlier. >.>

2 Likes

Since i play mostly with Medbay roles i’ve encountered Hawks-The-Eyes on plenty of opportunities, mostly of them acting as a CMO and i agree with Bloop statement, you have the knowledge to perform plenty of stuff as a CMO/RD but you certainly need to change the way you treat others and tone down the toxicity some levels. I won’t do another wall of text because i think Bloop encapsulated it perfectly.

In regards of people barely doing as you say there are plenty of methods and tools rp wise on how to approach situations like that, but obviously if you start with an aggresive stance towards the X player doing X stuff they’re most likely to not listen to you just because you’re approaching like that.

You have the knowledge, you just need to work with your anger a little bit.

I don’t mean to peanut gallery but you were consistently an asshole to everyone around you for weeks on end. As much of a shock to the system a permaban is, it’s not nearly enough for you to have truly hit rock bottom.

You were a consistent pain in the ass to play with. You exclusively picked roles with power and then made it difficult for other people to play around you. You made the game un-fun. I have had several experiences with you that I would consider to be metagrudging if I weren’t convinced you act this way to absolutely everyone.

A ban is absolutely deserved. People CAN change, but I doubt you have. Maybe you might change eventually, but you definitely haven’t.

Maybe if you come back in six months and say “yeah I was going through some shit but that’s over now,” but lmao not right the fuck after getting permabanned

Ironically I meet Hawks as roboticist, first experiance with him was him first being sarcastic but hey, its always more than getting morphine shot for asking how to treat brute wounds by a CMO.

He spent 45minutes explaining me how to create a stupid cyborg after which…Security barged in, killed him in the lab saying “he is a head rev”.
Later in OOC one guy said 'its always so easy to blame everything on Brille as he is perfect victim material".

Later on (days or weeks cant remember) as an AI had an insight this time from the side of…Captain. When someone on command said we got lings on the station he bluntly asked:
“Hey, AI we got Hawks-The-Eyes on station?”
“Yes, roboticist”
“Okey HoS, Arrest him, he is the ling”

Which ended in yes, sec rushing inside robo and…detective lethaling him with his revolver as “Cap said he is a ling”

When I asked on command why did Captain ‘commit crew harm action’ I was meet with reply:
“We need a scape goat and noone likes him”

I have quite a collection of “Lets blame it on Brille as he will react violently to anything” situations. Mostly because out of irony I started to play with him more and learned that he will brake his neck to help you if you show him a tiny bit of sympathy. Contrary to what he usually gets.
You can see it in one of the posts above.

He did that to himself? Perhaps.
Was he pushed into being salty bitch he become? Most likely.

Oh yes I agree that Hawks is toxic and while its unacceptable OOC its actually funny that most of the situations here are refering to IC behavior.

We are playing game where killing someone’s pet, calling owner names and crybaby is considered In Character issue, better.
Building endless loop out of disposals and adding some glass to it is ‘a prank’.
Captain who cards the AI round start saying “I dont trust AI’s” and carries you for 30 minutes is meet with “Well its character issue”.

Death threats inside game made you feel uneasy, have unpleasant experiance and feel sad? Cute.
Report it in game to your head, or if your head is said offender rise it to Captain.

If its in OOC, well its ban worthy.

But if you want to not lift the ban or to ban people basing on “In Character issues” then better decide.

Are we all hypocrites or are we treating all people equally.
Or perhaps we want to bully someone into oblivion.

6 Likes

Doesn’t matter why you’re an asshole if you’re an asshole consistently. Doesn’t matter if it’s “your environment” causing you to be an asshole or if you’re just a plain ol’ regular asshole because at the end of the day you’re being an asshole regardless.

Nobody’s born an asshole.

If it’s just the envrionment then clearly this isn’t a healthy environment for him anyway and he should take the ban as a hint and do something else for a while.

Are you definitely in the position to ask to get someone banned?

14 ban notes on page just this year. Mostly attempts to act as(or being) an self antag.

So while not being an antag you are creating toxic environment on the server fueling behavior as the one we are talking about here.

We could mention that one of the ban notes says ‘incompetence shown’(at his job) something that Brille is being triggered about constantly. So is it intentional or just happen to reoccur many times over short span of time.

And yet you call him being an ‘made asshole’ and needing to take a break.

To be honest he sounds like someone who takes the game and efficiency very, very seriously. That combined with a tendency to swearing and him being german ( more direct culture) might explain things. I am like that in league as well. Hell, my /TG/ admin report history can be rolled all over the floor because it took me a while to stop being hyper competitive.

I feel like a role ban from mrp head roles would fix the issue, giving that is most likely the reason why he goes mental (responsibility, “all the weight is on my shoulders”).
I do not get though why he is banned from Golden as well, giving that it is LRP.

2 Likes

It was a ban for OOC behavior and telling people to kill themselves. That nets you a double server ban and I’m surprised it didn’t get him a community removal.

Well yes, but you have to consider causality here. I think he goes mental because of the things I mentioned above. If he still goes apeshit after removing the roots of the issue, ye perma him forever. But why not try and instead fix the core issue first instead of just removing someone with lots of experience form the player pool? Seems more elegant.

3 Likes

This is… weird. I know Brille and, yes, he is toxic in ooc occasionaly, but then the rest of his behaviour is something ranging from RPing a person who is sarcastic yet does his job to just being actualy triggered. First time I met him he was a Robo and, as I asked if I can be borged, he replied with his typical sarcastic ‘Will you pay me?’ or some such and I was a bit surprised but I was told this player was competent so I just politely replied that he can take my ID’s money (I did not exactly catch his joke there) and he just ignored the obvious joke, seeing that I’m not in on it and proceeded to be nice and borged me. I could always rely on Brille being competent and he, knowing that I’m not ACTUALY trying to trigger him, never really misbehaved towards me.

On the other hand, as I’ve been hanging around as an assistant, trying to actualy assist, I’ve seen other players treating him like a valid, basicaly, and I dont know what I would do if I would be under the barrage of such behaviour. I’ve seen him being beaten or shot to crit in his own lab without being properly talked to, all because someone of command or sec said to detain him under a suspicions (talking in the common radio channel, even), to which I pretty much knew were false, as I was working around. I’ve also seen him try and remain calm while he was getting mistreated like this, knowing him better by that time I knew he was trying to play along the server’s standards but people just remember that they can try and push him and have some entertainment out of him.

I’ve met some unnice behaviour on MRP, all IC ofcourse, even if it ment me being killed as someones pet because ‘valid’, even if I was literaly TALKING to another crew, getting killed mid-conversation.
This kind of things happen occasionaly and make me want to go and slap someone for ruining RP for me… I can’t imagine what it’s like being someone KNOWN for being easy to madden, because some of the MRP players just genuinely like to make you feel bad because ‘server allows it’.

I dont see a reason for permaban, obviously OOC is different but OOC is filled with all kinds of other filth and no one bats an eye. What I propose, is Brille jumping off of Hawks-The-Eyes for a bit, making another character that will not be known for being a fun punching bag. Let him prove that he can start a new ‘life’ among the crew and be a competent and hardworking personel, as he was before, but without the unnecesary bait for others.

I appologise for the Walls-The-Text but I genuinely find Brille to be a nice, fun person to be around, if one actualy sees that he’s being sarcastic but hardworking and commited person.

5 Likes

@Brille

Well, its always easy to talk about a person when you only see the negative aspects.

A fair point, but also I haven’t had very many positive experiences with you, and the negative ones have left a pretty foul taste in my mouth. Perhaps my original post didn’t give you enough credit, as you’re certainly a competent CMO, just that your way of doing things is abhorrent and unenjoyable. I would much rather have a slightly less competent CMO who actually interacts with their staff normally than the way you do things. This game, at its core, is not about rushing tech or being technically competent, and you certainly shouldn’t try to excuse your behavior using these reasons.

So yea. I mostly have to do anything myself , because on the other hand if i dont do it, everyone quickly starts to shit at me for allegedly doing nothing against Insert Problem here .

While others have pointed out this valid issue, the unfortunate reality of this situation is that continuing to retaliate with anger only goads others to keep scapegoating you, regardless of if they are wrong. There’s always the opportunity for humour, deflection, subterfuge, or as Hassanira suggested, creating a new character. Fuck man, you could even ahelp it if it’s that bad.

Having consistent meltdowns over being scapegoated and constantly retaliating is also a shitty way for a leader (what a department head should strive to be) to be acting. Like I said previously, there’s better ways to deal with this. I experience in-game racism frequently as a catboy and honestly find it hilarous, and find it a lot of fun to go along with it.

Since i felt, in those situations, unfair treated i did “let the asshole part out”, tried to limit it against people who actually caused it but probably failed often enough.

Those situations seem to be the majority of situations and ‘the asshole part’ of you is always out.

I think @michiru2 made a good point

People CAN change, but I doubt you have. Maybe you might change eventually, but you definitely haven’t.

Maybe if you come back in six months and say “yeah I was going through some shit but that’s over now,”

In your reply to me you hold so little accountability for yourself and your actions, and you’re even downplaying the very things that got you banned, making them out to be isolated, infrequent incidents, when in reality this the normal standard for your behavior, how you behaved 99% of the time (at least in my experience).

Honestly, you don’t even seem to want to admit your behavior is shitty, and you don’t seem to recognize why it’s an issue. You’ve hardly taken accountability for your actions, and one deep breathing exercise is not sufficient to deal with the anger issues you clearly have.
I seriously think you should find someone to talk to about this issues, a therapist or a counselor, so this stuff doesn’t bleed into your real life. I’ve been around people who have anger issues and it destroys relationships and people end up doing things they regret. I’m not saying that’s gonna be you, but this stuff doesn’t magically disappear when you turn into an adult, and it’ll become a bigger problem if you don’t deal with it.

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I used to hate Hawks, dealing with him and all that. But he did change a lot of the things people used to call him out for. I ended up going from hating him to not minding him at all. Over a decent period of time that is.

But this should be a clear cut case of “Give him another chance, it will be clear if he changed or not.”

If he does, great. If he doesn’t, then at the very least you can point at this post and be like “YOU HAD THE CHANCE”

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Good luck in dealing with your anger issues dude. Aside from meditation I strongly recommend getting lots of exercise, it literally relaxes and dopes the brain with chemical happiness.

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People change. That said, people tend to change slowly. Considering you’re banned on here, TG and Fulp for the exact same thing going back ~1 year, I highly doubt you’ve changed that fast.

1 Like